Jos76’s Blog

Thoughts and musings on life in a gay marriage.

Marriage or Civil Union

Posted by jos76 on June 14, 2008

We hear so much about the word “marriage” these days. We usually hear it along with terms like “traditional” or “institution.” With the whole debate about gay marriage, those who are not in favor call for a more socially conservative view of “traditional marriage.” There are those opposed to granting gay couples the title of “married,” but are okay with civil unions. Then there are those that oppose any form of union for gay couples. I did some research (actually the Log Cabin Republicans did most of it it for me) and found out what “traditional” marriage really is and has been in history.

Many socially conservative, extreme right-wing politicians and religious leaders latch on to this idea of a return to traditional “marriage” and make statements like, “It is an institution that has been the norm for years and should not be changed or challenged.” Given what marriage has been historically and traditionally, Dac and I are not really interested in the “marriage” label. Civil Unions are fine with us as long as we can keep what we earn, give each other what we have earned, and visit each other freely.

Here are some examples of “traditional” marriage that should (apparently) not be changed. Dac and I are fine not having to adhere to these norms that the social conservatives think are important to retain in our modern society.

  1. An adult man would be allowed to marry a 12 year-old girl.
  2. Someone could be forced into a marriage arranged by their parents.
  3. A person would not be allowed to marry someone of another race.
  4. Men could treat their wives as property to be disposed of at will.
  5. A husband would be allowed to have multiple wives.
  6. A person could not marry someone of a different religion.
  7. A person could not marry someone from a different economic class.
  8. It would be impossible to divorce, no matter how physically or emotionally abusive your spouse.


11 Responses to “Marriage or Civil Union”

  1. anandabart said

    good blog and posts! i think we all need to do what we can to influence others and get the civil rights we all deserve. i would certainly like the Republican party to be more moderate on gay rights and appreciate what the Log Cabin Republicans are doing. half of them refused to vote for Bush. i think we need to elect those that support our interests, because in actual fact, it’s in the best interests of our nation and true freedom and democracy. you can read what i wrote here on this vein as well:

  2. How cool it will be when anyone & everyone who chooses to be, is married to their best friend. I’m married to my best friend, we’ve said for years… everyone should have what we have. For our anniversary in March I gave him named after a word we’ve coined for the strong Connection + Affection = CAFFECTION we share. For more details visit us at
    We’d love to have your feedback.
    Best to you,

  3. Paul Pruitt said

    I remember back when Strom Thermond was part of the congressional hearings on Gays in the Military.
    He would ask each of them if they were “an avowed homosexual”.

    Just once, I wish one of them would responded: “No sir, I am still single, but I would like very much to become Avowed some day.”

    We have pissed away a lot of time arguing about the proprietary usage of a word. The Republicans set us up with a “co-dependent trap” and we swallowed the bait rather than take another word and get our basic rights…NOW.

  4. jesseybean said

    Great post. I am a conservative, but have always believed that you should be able to marry the person you love no matter what. (You know, as long as they are two consenting adults.) Why would it effect me if some other woman married a woman. Doesnt hurt me none. As long as they are happy. I dont see what the big deal is.

  5. Slavery was the ‘social norm’ for years and the same people who are against gay marriage were against changing that!

  6. Carey said

    You know Jos, you might have seen this video on my blog or website, but earlier in the year Kathy and I went up to Harrisburg, PA. to help fight an amendment that they wanted to make to our state constitution which would basically make it illegal for gays and lesbians to even have civil unions or domestic partnerships in our state! (Absolutely ridiculous.)

    Anyway, after the hearing, we met up with a mother of a lesbian woman and went to each and everyone of our senators and state reps. offices to tell them to OPPOSE this bill (House Bill 1250.)

    While I was there, alot of times, we were talking to the Senators’ assistants, secretaries, etc. I asked everyone of them “Are you married?”

    They said “Yes.” I then asked “How’s the marriage going?”

    They would reply back and tell me how awesome marriage was and how wonderful their husband was and how life was just great.

    I’d say “Awesome. But you do know that I love this woman that’s sitting right next to me and I want to spend my life with her. We even just bought a house together.”

    They would just look at me. Then I’d ask “How’s your marraige NOW?”

    And, of course, each and everyone of them said “Ohhh, well it’s still wonderful. Why wouldn’t it be?”

    I said “My point exactly. The fact that we are 2 women and that we love each other has no bearing on you, your marriage or your life!”

    Each and everyone said “Yes, I know. Believe me girls, I’m on your side with this one!”

    It was just really interesting to interactive with folks, including the Senators who were kind enough to meet with us (one of which Andy Diniman) told us that even talking about this bill is an absolutely waste of time and it should never get past. He said it was really sad that we have take time out of our lives and busy schedules and sooo much stuff that THEY have to do to talk about this non-sense. It shouldn’t even need to be discussed. (Btw, he was on our side too and completely opposed this bill.)

    Anyway, I know I’m being long winded and I apologize, but I want folks to know that you really need to get involved, even locally. Know what’s going on in your states, know what your senators and such are trying to get passed and when you don’t agree….TELL THEM ABOUT IT! The best way to tell them about it is going up there to their state office (or their local office,) then by phone and then lastly by emails and letters. Nothing beats an in person visit with a REAL LIFE STORY.

    All of Our Gay Lives depend on it (in the U.S. anyway!)


  7. I usually try my best to see both sides of an issue. On this one, I fail. I really cannot get my head around why anyone would want to ban same-sex marriage. There simply are no reasons.


  8. Bill said

    Guys there is a great LGBT civil rights organization called the Empowering Spirits Foundation. They are very creative in how they approach this hot topic issue, in that they engage in service oriented activities in communities typically opposed to equal rights to foster thought and change for LGBT equality.

    A friend of mine told me about it and I thought it was a great, positive approach to the issue. We had so much fun at the last event and it was great to give back to the community. Plus it was great to converse with others on the other side of the table in a way that wasn’t confrontational.

    Anyway, this can be such a heated issue and I thought this was a unique approach.

  9. melesha12 said

    Too bad that in 2009 we still have to discuss oppression.

  10. Natalie said

    It amazes me when this discussion comes up and the arguments that are being made for this particular issue. What amazes me more, however, is that the Republican Party is that party that is trying to create laws that enact more government regulations into the people’s rights. Am I wrong, or isn’t one of the issues that the Republican Party stands for is less government control? Or is that just when it is their lives that the government is trying to control that they get upset?

    Also the one thing that is never brought up when trying to ban gay-marriage is the word love. I was under the impression that love was the most important thing when choosing to get married, I guess I was wrong on that assumption. I guess the most important thing is that they are not the same sex as me. Maybe if the Republican Party and all those that oppose gay marriage focus more on love, they would open their eyes and see that allowing someone to marry whoever they want to marry is a good thing and not a bad thing.

  11. Lynn said

    I learned more in these comments than in any actual “gay marriage” article I’ve ever read. I know this is an old post but I’m really hoping you update it with current stats. Thanks!

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